False Prophets

Any teacher or prophet who does not genuinely wish, encourage and enable students or adherents to ultimately learn and discover beyond what he has to impart is really no teacher or prophet at all.

False teachers and prophets use the learning process as a means to control or enslave rather than to empower or free.

No matter how eloquent or compelling a teacher or prophet may appear to be, whether he is leading one to heaven, purgatory, perdition or ignorance can be predicted by applying this simple standard.

105 responses to “False Prophets

  1. AMEN! Not much else needs to be said.

  2. Yes, your right. And further, to not ALLOW but rather PROHIBIT any of that growth pretty much seals the deal on what we are dealing with here. Control, enslave and self-aggrandizement. Each sees it in their own time. Thankfully its our time.

  3. Marty,
    One of the reasons I began to question then & eventually leave Scn is-it did not do as was espoused: “Make the able more able”.

    Despite I made progress on The Bridge, it was never enough, I never felt I had enough time to experience the ‘wins’, rather than being allowed to really validate the win or cog, it was always more regging onto the next level or whatever was the new ‘Bridge’ fad!

    I saw OT 7 & 8’s driven crazy by the continued 6 month sec checks to enrich the ‘church’s’ pockets, again rather than validate their completions, it was now a money grab and no longer a spiritual journey!

    Until I came to you for auditing, I had seldom, if ever, experienced the amount of ARC or duplication as I did with you. I left empowered: my problem solved, with my stats and happiness left to my own destination.

    Thanks for being a GREAT teacher and just for being who you are. YOU are wonderful.

    Midge

  4. Amen. When I left the church, I looked for myself at what was the life lesson I needed to learn that required this experience. I boiled it down to “no more gurus” but realized it was slightly more nuanced than that. I had listened to the sales pitch and followed the lead of someone I admired and trusted. I figured the worst that would happen would be that I dabbled a bit and then decide it wasn’t for me and go on to the next big thing. I was very naive about how I could get caught in a now defined prison of belief. With experience comes wisdom. I believe I am wiser now. If it had not been cofs, perhaps could have been another cult.

    May we all find peace and joy in our lives.

  5. absolutely! whether schools, universities, church’s whatever!

  6. “Clearly the person who accepts the Church as an infallible guide will believe whatever the Church teaches.” — Saint Thomas Aquinas

  7. Well spoken Marty, and you demonstrated this principle with this blog.

  8. Good Observation, Marty.

    That is why I love Buddha.

  9. As I come to understand Buddha, I have the following to say.

    All certainties are relative. This statement does not degrade any certainty we have. It simply means that one can always come up with a better certainty.

    That is how science makes progress. Einstein declared the speed of light to be a universal constant. This is a certainty for now, but there may possibly be a wider context in which the speed of light is a special case.
    .

  10. Thank you for this. I am writing it out, and passing it on to my children, grandchildren and friends.

  11. Yes. And the seas of humanity are awash with these false prophets.

    Hubbard, Smith, Muhammed (PBUH), Koresh, Torop (Vissarion), Bent, Miller, Rajneesh, and on and on.

    Some of them even believe they are who they claim.

    My profoundest disappointment in Scientology came when I realized that instead of a consciouness-paradigm shift into a new level of awareness, it amounted to just some new stories in the same mold of typical human ideas — more vegetables in the same stew.

    The Xenu story was a pathetic disappointment. How that story would pale to insignificance if it were ever to compare with actual enlightenment wherein one pierced, through direct and verifiable seeing, to the ultimate nature of self, others, and all things?

    I would suggest that false prophets share another trait: they are tellers of stories that cannot be falsified. And like children fearing the dark, we cluster round hoping that what we are seeing is really the light.

  12. This also goes for parents

  13. L. Ron Hubbard made some unique discoveries about the universe around us and the nature and course of life on Earth. Some of his discoveries can’t really be re-discovered only discussed. But it is almost as if through his own writings that he did not really want for all people to share in those discoveries with him until he was sure of 1 thing. And that one thing is still a huge topic of discussion among many people. I find it unfathomable that anyone can tell anyone in this universe they are immortal without sharing in the truth behind it with everybody.

  14. Yes, Marty. I prefer my own path but the tips from you and your friends are helping me enormously!

  15. Well, here is a funny. On 20 Jan, 2015 I guess I had insomnia. 3am I ordered the ‘free’ CD for depression, anxiety etc. Well…. No one has pulled that trick on me for 4 or 5 years. Guess I’m back to real life – soon to move on. Of course my account has been debited the 10.85 for the S&H and then the 75$ for the depression handling. When will I ever learn???

  16. So true Marty.

    And may I add, a true preceptor relishes in the students independence. To the preceptor it is a sign of advancement of the student and good stewardship of spiritual teaching.

    It’s called Self Realization not Teacher Realization.

  17. Quote: Any teacher or prophet who does not genuinely wish, encourage and enable students or adherents to ultimately learn and discover beyond what he has to impart is really no teacher or prophet at all.

    Yes Marty, that is true.

    Hubbard did do so, but not genuinely.

    If an intelligent and competent student of scn (Hubbard), who did his homework diligently, and had eyes to see, ears to hear, and a mind to think for himself and evaluate, and read: “How to study a science” and did what the article says, and did it properly, would of figured that out. His eyes would of been opened. (Keep in mind that there is a right way and wrong way to do almost everything.)

    That is why I say, scn is a trap for fools, and a gold mine of knowledge, wisdom and power for the wise.

    I get the sense (a hunch) that is what Hubbard had in mind when he wrote that article.

    He gave other clues here and there, too.

    Another one is: The purpose of scientology is to make a Christian a better Christian.

    You could say that is in esoteric language, or code. It is meant for Statics.

    As far as Jesus goes:

    I can’t recall anything specific that Jesus said, except; Why do ye marvel, you shall do greater things than I.

    And I come that ye may have life and have it more abundantly.

    Paraphrase in modern language:

    I come that you may have success and have it more abundantly.

    Also, Jesus did not come to save anyone’s souls. He came to save the world.

    I do not think anyone can really save anyone, except that one save himself. Although someone can tell you about it, show you the way and help you, but no one can do it for you.

    There is nothing on this planet that I am aware of that does a better job than Dianetics for saving souls. The best we got is each other, or a co auditor.

    It is a lie that “Scientology works”.

    I have not met one person that I would give a good pass mark too in all my 17 yrs in scn.

    At best I see that scn can help some people to some degree, and with great variance.
    Or scn works with great variance.

    It also depends on: If a being is a GE, a thetan or a Static.

    The full benefit of scn can only be achieved by the honest, intelligent and diligent student if they combine it with the teachings of Christianity.

    The collective benefits of the two would be exponentially greater than the sum of it’s parts.
    🙂

    Dio

  18. Not unlike good parents … who guide their children, keep them from harm without putting them under a glass … and bit by bit encourage them to stand on their own. And leave home.

    With the wish in the hearts of the parents … may you take the best of us out into the world and with the best of you … be more that we were …

    And thus a society and culture grows.

    Windhorse

    • Here are some ways to bless your children.

      Blessings= Implants

      Some examples of the right way to implant your children:

      http://www.familylife.com/articles/topics/parenting/foundations/spiritual-development/are-you-blessing-your-children#.VPOuReEt624

      http://www.trcpella.com/uploads/Praying%20Blessing%20For%20Your%20Children.pdf

      http://www.charismamag.com/life/family-parenting/15245-speaking-blessings-upon-your-children

      Can you imagine what your life would of been like, if you got a blessing (implant) like that?

      I have a strong Christian family next door. Five boys and one girl. Oldest is about 14 now.

      Mother home schools them. Most amazing mother I have ever met.

      These kids glow like 1000 watt light bulbs.

      I have never seen more enlightened and intelligent children in my life.

      There is a very similar family across the street. Five children.

      My heart cries with tears of joy when I watch them.

      We are only as good as we have been bred and brought up.

      We are a product of a conception and an upbringing.

      If you have a problem with the product, you have to check the factory for the cause of the problem.

      Dio

      • Blessing = implant?

        We are not at all on the same page.

        • Windhorse,

          You: We are not at all on the same page.

          Me: Think again.

          But this time think for your self.

          Think outside the box of what you have been taught in scn and the cos.

          You have evidently not read “How to study a science” and applied the data, and did as instructed, or at least not properly, if you did any.

          Any thought or datum that goes into the mind, is by nature an implant.
          It is all data, like in a computer.

          Everything you have been taught is an implant of some sort.

          You are the sum total of everything you have been taught and have experienced, positive and negative under all conditions.

          There is survival data and non survival or anti survival data.

          Anti survival data is called a “death wish” in conventional psychiatry and social circles:

          1. Psychiatry
          a. A desire for self-destruction, often accompanied by feelings of depression, hopelessness, and self-reproach.

          b. The desire, often unconscious, for the death of another person, such as a parent, toward whom one has unconscious hostility.

          2. A suicidal urge thought to drive certain people to put themselves consistently into dangerous situations.

          3. An unconscious desire to screw things up, make things go wrong, fail or self sabotage one self.

          There are positive implants and negative implants.

          They “in terms of that they affect the beings life experience” mean the same thing.

          Similar to how the data in a computer program works.
          Garbage in-garbage out, good data in- good data out,
          mixture of good data and garbage data in, mixture of good data and garbage data out.

          And there are every degree of stickness, how well they are implanted, now well they are stuck, and every possible other datum that also goes into the mind.
          Everything is a postulate.

          Everything is operating data.

          There are only two things in life: life and postulates.

          And at what level of awareness (consciousness) (tone level) the information, the data went in.

          And every other factor, the same factors that effect the effectiveness of an engram.

          Including the positive data.

          Suppose for a hypothetical example, at the end of an incident that caused an engram, the following words were said by the person who caused the problem:

          I am sorry all this happened. Everything that I said in this engramic incident is cancelled, everything that happened during this incident, is cancelled and will have no effect upon you, and you will be clear. I am sorry. Please forgive me.

          Hubbard said in dianetics: the engram can contain any combination of every word in a language and every nuance and every cliche.

          The power is in the word.

          Dio

          • I forgot to complete my thought on the following statement I wrote:

            I am sorry all this happened. Everything that I said in this engramic incident is cancelled, everything that happened during this incident, is cancelled and will have no effect upon you, and you will be clear. I am sorry. Please forgive me.

            Is this incident going to result in an engram?

          • Dio,

            “Windhorse,
            You: We are not at all on the same page.
            Me: Think again.
            But this time think for your self.”
            “You have evidently not read “How to study a science” and applied the data, and did as instructed, or at least not properly, if you did any.”

            What a pompous arrogant ignoramus you are.

            It might have something to do with your deeply held superstition that Peter Pan was an historical character and that Santa Claus sits in his heavenly throne, high on amanita mushrooms he has bouts of bad temper and condemns us mortals

            • Conan.

              RE: What a pompous arrogant ignoramus you are.

              It might have something to do with your deeply held superstition that Peter Pan was an historical character and that Santa Claus sits in his heavenly throne, high on amanita mushrooms he has bouts of bad temper and condemns us mortals

              >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>

              1. Only a fool would talk like you.

              From your point of view, any comm from near the bottom of the tone scale and theta scale is grist for your mill. It is what you allow on blogs such as this one.

              Anything above tone level three is inflammatory, and causes you to boil over, and must be condemned.

              You definitely flunked scn.

              I suspect you are high on those amanita mushrooms.
              (First time I hear the word btw.)

              2. There are two ways of establishing a reputation.
              One is to be praised by honest men,
              And the other is to be condemned by rogues.

              It is however best to secure the first,
              because it will always be accompanied by the latter.
              Charles Caleb Colton

              3. I suggest you go and do your homework. That means start from the beginning and very carefully read Dianetics and all scn books. Make sure you word clear all MUs.

              Pay particular attention to “How to study a science” and apply the data.

              Dio

          • Dio, you are making a good attempt of implanting windhorse. But, I think your attempt will fail.

      • No Dio, blessings are not an implant. Neither are faith healing or people’s kindness to one another.

        Now, the following are religious memes, pushed by religionists and charlatans like you:

        “Also, Jesus did not come to save anyone’s souls. He came to save the world.”

        “There is nothing on this planet that I am aware of that does a better job than Dianetics for saving souls.”

        • Conan,

          The truth is determined by honest, intelligent, probituous men, properly informed on the subject. Those very high on the theta scale. Those with a sound, respected and confirmed reputation for sound judgement.

          The truth is not determined by authority, beliefs, opinions, or by who wins an argument, And certainly not by those low on the theta scale.

          Dio

  19. Right on! Genuine teachers give their students ownership of the knowledge, for example by encouraging discussion and comparison of alternative ideas.

  20. threefeetback

    Self evident corollary, but for the scum of the Earth.

  21. He told us what we wanted to hear and we did not question him. We were not allowed to. I always wondered why I wasn’t allowed to read other things but put up with his rules because I had to go up the bridge. What a crock!

  22. I find self-learning to be the basis of all real learning.

    What is Self Learning?
    .

  23. Brilliant, Marty. Why didn’t I think of that!

    I’m passing it on to whomever needs to hear (read) it. Thank you!

  24. You all should study anything and everything under the sun except for scientology because thats all bad and you must never read any books on that , why , because we say so and we know everything .

    • It is not a matter of what you should or should not study. It is matter of being mindful when you study.

      The 12 Aspects of Mindfulness

      1. Observe without getting influenced by your expectations and desire for answers.
      2. Observe things as they are, without assuming anything.
      3. If something is missing do not imagine something else in its place.
      4. If something does not make sense then do not explain it away.
      5. Use physical senses as well as mental sense to observe.
      6. Let the mind un-stack itself.
      7. Experience fully what is there.
      8. Do not suppress anything.
      9. Associate data freely.
      10. Do not get hung up on name and form.
      11. Contemplate thoughtfully.
      12. Let it all be effortless.

  25. Well said. Not even Crowley or Parsons could do better.

  26. How much time you need to study LRH complete? Beside of all restudy you have to do, it will need a lifetime. Unfortunately to it, you have to study it in next lifetime again .. and also later again and again .. forever ..

    Look at currently re-done student hats .. some study it again and again and again .. what have they missed in the first place? There is nothing to miss in basic, because it is very simple ..

    There is no real reason in the world for studying how to study. For LRH it was .. but it was for making it sure that nobody will ever misunderstand him without the point that it may be possibly not understandable .. which it is in some ways .. LRH solved a problem with his students .. his problem, not so much a real problem in the world .. it is not wrong to know that you may go in trouble if you miss the study barriers .. but tell me, why it is not in use at every school on the Earth now .. it is too simple, everbody can grasp that if once heard about ..

    My last word to it. I have never cleared a word if the whole thing made no sense to me. For what? Example: Lower Conditions and handling of .. it is something which made never sense to me ..

    Why? Ohh, a liability is not caused by fallen out of Non-Ex .. a non-ex is caused by a liability .. this works ..

  27. Lets give an example. A person can go in non-ex because his desire for life may be completely out of order (confusion) .. he his on his way to quit ..

    Naturally is such a person a liability for every group, you can not trust such a person .. but there is no why for it .. and you will not (never) find the why with the liability formula .. you will find it with the confusion formula .. but it is a case condition and not an ethics condition .. it is case ..

    Point is .. you had to have a liability around you, before you did quit .. with it you went into non-ex .. which means non-ex is caused from others .. and not standing up against is your failure .. surely is it your fault .. but handling it with liability (and your agreement with it to do so) is the next failure .. you will jump fast into confusion .. sure, because there is no way from liability across Doubt and Enemy or Treason to Confusion .. it is useable as a formula if the condition is there .. but it is no scale .. scientology use it as a scale, but it is no scale at all ..

    Scientology goes simply this way, if you do not agree with LRH scripture, you are a liability .. if you refuse the formula (quite normal not to do) .. than you get Doubt .. but here you can only decide pro scientology .. and if not you are Enemy .. you should now find out who you really are .. nice, but you was always you before .. very confusing .. and so you get Treason and it is expected that you use false data from others .. you try to destroy the church and the work of LRH ..

    But truth is, and no scientologist has ever grasp it up to now .. if somebody gives you the indication of liability .. you are immediately in confusion, it is the way how life runs with us .. it is a bad ARC break .. nothing else ..

    The church uses this as Standard Tech .. but it is the greatest bullshit I have ever heard of .. and I have never read or heard from LRH that it should be used this way .. but it is certainly used in this way ..

    I am sure that nobody in this blog did not run into this bullshit, so wanted to speak about .. finally it means, if Study Tech is so needed as claimed from LRH .. it should be used .. it is only not getting the words, or not knowing about .. the question of gradient goes here to the teachers ..

    The point of non-ex goes with the idea that we should not overrun the idea of another .. if he understands, he will be a friend ..

  28. When studying some of the Hindu teachings I came across this idea, which completely blew my mind: When starting on your path to enlightenment you may need a Guru to help you get along, but eventually you must break away and follow your own path. You are, in the end, your only source. Essentially, and in time, we will have billions of “religions” as each individual is on his own path.

    As much as I feel SCN, in so many ways, is a total mess, I am still aware that it did help me on several front, and most notably, it did help me start on my path to spirituality. That said, no matter if SCN was perfect, I eventually had to break away.

    LRH on the other hand, made it very clear that no on should ever leave nor counter his “source” ideas. This is completely contrary to truth in the long run.

  29. Enslavement under the guise of instruction has a very long and sordid history. It was actually the first form of control. It was performed on allies before it was used on enemies. The closest knife to your back is often being held by your ‘friend’.
    Mark

    • I am not sure if your comment was a reply to mine (above), but I did want to note the following;

      As much as i now believe SCN to be enormously flawed and that i would never recommend it to another, I did make some unbelievable gains that changed my life, ones that i do not believe I would have made any other way. Those gains, though, were not necessarily and soley because of the “tech” or the workability of SCN. They were more because I dove into the search for spiritual freedom because of SCN. Prior, I had tried other paths, but for the life of me could not get anything out of them. Maybe they were written to old school or perhaps I was not ready, but with westernized terminologies I could “get” Scientology and because of that i dove into my mind; I learned how to see past incidents throughout history; I got trained and learned how to help others; I learned what sociopaths are (clearly); i learned to grant beingness to others (clearly not from SCN); I learned how to spot false claims of sociopaths; and so on. And now, interstingly enough, I can really own other religions and their ideas. Life has opened up.

      Funny thing is that it is not so much the tech that helped me. It is that I dove into the search, and in a strange yin/yang sort of way, I have to thank SCN for inviting me in. I think without it I just would have pooped along in life without any direction or path.

      Do I think LRH went loopy? yes. Do I think KSW1 was the first real evidence of his egomania? yes. But all that said, i really do believe that somehow SCN was necessary and helpful on my path.

      I believe it was in the Tao Te Ching where one must learn that there is no real good or bad. You never know when that “bad” thing will turn out to be the most positive/good lesson of all…that is somewhat how I see SCN…one big old mess that actually turned out wildly positive.

      Maybe most importantly, by seeing it all first hand, I learned that no one else is source in my life…that ultimately it is all my responsibility.

      just sayin’

      • Jonsty.
        I have to say that it was LRH, and then others, who got me started on the greatest adventure of my life. It was worth sifting through the muck to find the diamonds. I am now able to find jewels in places I was not told to look. I could not, or rather would not, have found what I have without the suggestions of Ron, other thinkers, my friends on this and other sites, and my own efforts.
        I’m having fun.
        Mark

      • Hi jonsty. After reading your comments I’m prompted to share this…

        I have lots of what I call Monteisms one of which is: It is never about what I think it is about. My Scn experience is such a wonderful symbol of it is never about what I think it’s about. For example: I never thought my Scn experience was about being ready to let go of attachments or about being ready to commit to something or about taking a leap of faith and throwing myself, without question, wholeheartedly into a belief system. Yet, my Scn experience was very much about these things and so much more. There was so much I gained from that experience.

        Regardless of how others might interpret and judge another’s path, I truly believe that there is not one individual that is, at any given time, not on the exact path that they are ready for and is tailor made for them. And when the person is ready for a different path that path becomes instantly available. When I was ready for Scn it was there and when I became ready for a different path that path was too there. And so it goes.

        It’s funny…although I pretended to (especially to myself) I never did really learn what Scn was teaching. I am grateful for this. But, ironically, through Scn I did learn many lessons of much greater value and benefit to my process of incremental awakening. Or, I could say, the process of my gradually becoming ready for the next path that always instantly appears when I am ready.

        Regardless of how intellectual and confident I might at times appear to be in presenting this purpose I have of self awakening, the truth is, the journey to fully remembering and fully recognizing who and what I really am has been and is a terrifying journey. However, that being noted, it is becoming far less terrifying. After all, my Scn experience gave me numerous opportunities to learn how to let go of attachments. And to remember and recognize who and what I really am I have to let go of absolutely everything I have learned as well as all of my attachments (all those things which have nothing at all to do with who and what I really am).

        I have taken the training wheels off and no longer look outside myself for direction. I trust now, more than ever, my own internal guidance system. No longer is there need for debates, comparisons, doubts or the compulsion to adjust, fix or save anything or anyone. Although, I must admit, I do slip back into these old programs of thinking (ego thinking) yet do not linger there for long. All I really need do is to listen and follow my own voice within. And I am more ready to do that than ever before.

        The True SELF that each one of us actually is does know what is best for us at any given time as the True SELF views everything as being simultaneous, not as separate, exact incidents of cause and effect in linear time and space.

    • “Know thyself-and the truth shall set you free.

      Therefore in Scientology we are not concerned with individual actions and differences. We are only concerned how to show Man he can set himself or herself free” etc. from “My philosophy”.

      I reference this because it was the overriding issue that glued the whole thing together for me for nearly 30 years till I discovered that a lot of what he writes in this essay is provably false. (“Blinded and crippled at the end of the war…” etc). The other nagging thought I always had about it was that if that was really your only intentions, why would you feel the need to brag about it? The whole essay can be viewed “look how worthy and noble I am”.

      • Hello Martin, good to speak to you.

        I once had a friend who was actually a common thief and pothead, and general scoundrel. He used his energies for little good other than his own temporary pleasures. His word had little value.

        He once relayed an observation about human nature that was very profound and turned out to be quite valuable to me.

        I have made observations that were published by no others. I also have some sordid portions of my past which I do not wish to share with anyone, since they involve other people.

        A person’s life taken as a whole, good and bad, is an INDICATION of the value and usefulness of their philosophy and statements, but it is not proof. Ron Hubbard, since we are on the subject, did many unsavory things as evidenced by the quantity of reports. He also did and discovered and compiled many great things, as evidenced by the quantity of reports. To discount either without honest investigation is foolish

        His name is mentioned often in other writings because of the quantity of his accomplishments and misdeeds. Even manure has great value and the world could not be fed today without it’s substance and study. Smallpox is kept alive for it’s study.

        I believe nothing and I discount nothing. That mode has served me well for quite some time, but will quickly change should it prove wrong or unneeded in the future. My work continues.
        Thanks, Mark

        • christianscientology

          Hi Mark

          Unlike you “I believe everything” and then rely on my intuition to assign whatever it is, its order of importance. Note I am differentiating between believing everything and believing anything, the second I would call gullibility.

          Love Pip

          • Believe everything, not anything. Assign relative importance.
            Interesting line of thought. It deserves consideration.
            Mark

  30. Simple and to the point, thank you.

  31. False teachers, prophets and those that see themselves as being less than those who they follow the teachings and guidance of are all constructs of unconscious thought. These constructs act as the proverbial veil that obscures the light and fosters a seemingly endless journey strewn with experiences of misery,pain, suffering and death. This is the journey through “hell.” But it is not an infinite journey, thankfully, it is a finite journey that reverses its course the instant when consciousness awakes enough to desire a better way. That desire parts the veil enough to allow SELF to reach the now not so completely unconscious concept of self and the awakening begins.

    When my trajectory crossed paths with the trajectory of Scn (no accident), I was looking for a better way than Christianity, which was the religion I had been exposed to and rejected prior to my meeting with Scn. L. Ron Hubbard and Scn, for quite sometime, offered me a better way. But the abundance of misery, pain and suffering that I experienced in my Scn journey eventually brought me once again to that point where I declared “There’s got to be a better way!” This declaration broke the spell, so to speak, and I suddenly found myself free of a belief system designed by a thought system with the objective to keep myself securely behind the veil and away from the light of my SELF. Every step I took in Scn was a step away from the light of my SELF.

    I have come to recognize that the awakening process of consciousness is highly individualized and that it impossible for me to make a judgment with regards to another’s path regardless of how it appears to me and how I am interpreting it. Another thing I have come to recognize is that whenever I seem to meet another, whether in form or in thought, we are both teacher and student simultaneously and neither, regardless of appearances, is not above or below the other. Finally, and this is the most important recognition, I fully know that I don’t know nor do I understand. And because I do not know…I believe. Abstracts like Know, Truth, Love, Understanding, etc. cannot be found nor do they exist in Hell. That said, I have come to believe that, by listening to and following the guidance of SELF, I can eventually let go of the artificial myself that is wanting to pretend that hell is reality.

    • christianscientology

      Hi Monte

      I follow what you are saying and this idea that there is a SELF that one can follow the guidance of is just another twist of the ego. There is a SELF but it exists in Jesus Christ. I am a student of THE COURSE and I find what it has to say most interesting, but it is not THE WAY. Jesus said “I am the way, the truth and the life. No one comes to the father accept through me.” John 14:6.

      Yours in Christ
      Pip

      • Hey Pip! About SELF…I use a lot of different words to point to the abstract non-duality that I believe I truly am. For example: instead of SELF I might use ME, YOU, intuition, IGS (internal guidance system), Holy Spirit, Christ, Christ Self, Jesus, Great Spirit, gut, higher self, higher power and so on. What word I use when is not something that I think about. I just go with whatever comes up when it comes up (I see that as following the guidance).

        Pip, you included this in your reply…Jesus said “I am the way, the truth and the life. No one comes to the father accept through me.” John 14:6.

        Here’s how I interpret this statement supposedly made by Jesus: First off, the person i.e., Jesus or whatever the original given name was, was nothing but a construct of thought generated by an artificial thought system (the ego) wherein the consciousness (for lack of a better word) that seemed to be imprisoned and identified with that particular artificial self concept fully awakened and recognized that the self concept was illusory and meaningless as itself yet could be very useful as a communication device, albeit illusory, to speak to seemingly other person constructs. In other words, the consciousness that identified itself as being Jesus or whatever other name, fully awakened to who, what and where it really was i.e., The Christ (the extension of God..whatever God is).

        Christ has never been in the non-reality of existence aka, the illusion of perception, the cosmos, the mest universe, etc. My point is…it was never Jesus speaking, it was The Christ speaking through Jesus, using the illusory Jesus as an illusory communication device in order to help awaken illusory others in a world of make believe.

        “I am the way, the truth and the life. No one comes to the father accept through me.” When consciousness can completely let go of its attachment and identification with an artificial self concept in an artificial world and fully recognize itself as The Christ it always was,..well, it will be home where it never left.

        • “No one comes to the father except through me.”

          From what I have read about the life and teachings of Jesus of Nazareth, and from the writings of those who claim to have lived near or shortly after him, it is my opinion that he did not actually say this. It does not fit the flavor of this man.

          Just my thoughts.
          Mark

          • Hey Mark, with the purpose of sharing not asserting, I have this to say… I believe that it is more probable than not that the statements contained in the Bible that are assigned to one character or another as being the source of the statement, including, of course, those statements cited as being spoken by the Jesus character, are far from being accurately recorded. And, even if everything written in the Bible was an accurate recording with all statements correctly linked to the bonafide source of origination…the intended meaning is, more often than not, completely missed.

            Mark, I have come to believe that the seeming physical universe is nothing but one big metaphor and there is nothing within this universe that is literal (this includes the perception of matter, energy, space and time). I also believe that the continued drama as it plays out in the seemingly multi-dimensional physical universe occurs because the metaphor, the allegory, is mistaken to be literal.

            You might find this video by Bill Donahue of some interest.

            • Monte
              “Merrily, merrily, life is but a dream.”
              As long as we’re stuck in this metaphor, we might as well learn all we can about it. Perhaps gain some semblance of control for ourselves.
              Mark

          • christianscientology

            I agree Mark, and if Jesus of Nazareth was a “mere man” then that statement would be the height of arrogance, but that is the whole point he was and is not a “mere man” Read John 10:33 “……. ‘We are not stoning you for any good work,” they replied, “but for blasphemy, because you, a mere man, claim to be God’ ………..”

            Love
            Pip

        • christianscientology

          Hi Monte

          You use the phrase “(the extension of God … whatever God is)”. It is my contention that GOD IS PERSONHOOD and because you and I are made in His image and likeness we are PERSONS, this for me give me my identity in God. So where Jesus says “I and my father are one” and also assures me I am in him and he is in me, I can be at rest.

          Love
          Pip

      • Hi again Pip! Of the many individuals I’m aware of that are out there publicly speaking about A Course in Miracles, a guy by the name of David Hoffmeister is my current preference. In view of what we’ve communicated in our comments here this video of David’s seems apropos.

        • christianscientology

          Thanks for posting the video of David Hoffman Monte. This way of viewing reality is not new to me, Master Teacher of Endeavour Academy fame has said the same thing, in fact in one of his talks he says that in truth there is only one person in the room. When a member of the audience challenges that view by saying “no there is not,I am here” his answer is “You see I can even “mock-up” someone to disagree with my view”.

          What I don’t get is if all there is is me, and everything I am aware of is my projection, then I am projecting Scientology – David Miscavige – Marty Rathbun – in fact even you Monte. In that case GOD IS IN HIS HEAVEN AND ALL IS WELL WITH THE WORLD.

          Love with understanding
          Pip

  32. A father figure would be a prophet early in ones live. Blessed are the ones with a father or mother that loves them to prosper in life.

    If such is not your fortune and if you make something of yourself in life

    Than you truely are beyond prophets.

    • Hello Cat.
      One CAN become greater than the sum of his parts. One CAN rise above his past. The student CAN surpass his teacher and it is even possible for the student to honestly evaluate and correct his teacher. A true teacher would be disappointed in a student who only wallowed in his teachings.

      Thanks for pointing this out. “WE CAN POSSESS MORE THAN WE HAVE BEEN GIVEN.” (MNR)
      Mark

  33. “There is no taming here for one fond of conceit,
    “nor is there sagehood for the unconcentrated.”
    “One who conceives ‘I am equal, better or worse,’
    Might on that account engage in disputes.”
    -Buddha

    I gave Hubbard the benefit of the doubt until OT VIII
    on the Freewinds in 1988. He was conceited and
    he did engage in disputes. He concentrated on
    power and wealth. Thus he ended in paradox
    holding on to theories.

    • Didn’t Hubbard pass away in 1986? Are you talking about Miscavige?

    • Good point.
      I considered Hubbard immortal until 1988 – thetan belief.
      Hey, I was devoted.

      • anitawarren1,
        My post does leave open a few questions so I need to elaborate.
        I was only thinking about Hubbard. I did have a brief encounter with
        Miscavige at the time. I viewed him as one who seeks fortune and
        control. He did not impress me as a spiritual leader. In fact, after
        meeting him, I was convinced that Hubbard was false because I could
        not imagine Miscavige as the future leader. Thus the combination of
        Hubbard’s OT VIII Student Briefing and my impression of Miscavige was
        all that I needed for a new viewpoint.
        Despite the fact that I was almost dysfunctional in thinking at the time because of scientology, I had enough left in the tank to see the truth.
        I have covered my viewpoint of Hubbard’s words on other blogs and
        I have been severely hit for my conclusion. I think that Hubbard
        was in confusion when he wrote that document. In fact, what no one seems to accept, is the hidden message “get out of scientology.”
        His contradictions about the anti-Christ and Buddhism are so huge that it is possible to see his dead end. Hubbard was not smart enough to see his own contradictions. Thus I tend to think that his message was beneath the level of his own consciouness.
        I had someone with great knowledge of scientology try to find the meaning of “concentration” in scientology. It is used only a few times relative to the auditor’s control of the PC. Thus I directly conclude that Hubbard was not a sage. Hubbard’s conceit was obvious. In his early lectures, I get the impression that he was in the clouds of his head. Margaret O’Brien was one of his early followers. She wrote that Hubbard spoke mostly without notes and hardly prepared for his lectures. This was so obvious. Hubbard was speaking from the viewpoint of the “exteriorized thetan” He could make it up as he went along. The problem is that he ran out of time and could not solve his paradox. I have taken heavy hits on these points, but it is my personal view.

        Much Metta,
        GMW

  34. Superb points and great that they are brought up to be examined.

    A genuine “guru”, in my view and experience, a person who has truly reached a high spiritual condition, sees “guruism” as a trapping tool, with its main purpose being the disempowering of others so that their power is given to him.

    A true vampire of souls that leaves them dependent, weak, trapped, and delusional (believing they are evolving),

    The most evil act, to me, is the entrapment and disempowering of a soul.

    Regards,
    Luis

  35. Somebody there who can help me out? Knows somebody here how LRH did find the OT III case. How he has done that. How he could do that? It looks impossible to find something like that as truth without any evidence ..

    He said he was the first one who break through the Wall of Fire, some had tried but died .. how he could know that? Why he said that a thetan can be unconscious to himself for such a long time? Why are this aliens so bad for us .. why they are so bad .. because of this silly implant on islands which did not exist at the given time period ..

    How could LRH find this out as reality? Why is it confidential? Why is it made the way it is .. if this aliens really exist, everybody would collide with them in any given auditing .. you would not know at what you are really looking if you run an engram or a problem or an overt .. when you call it reactive mind .. I mean, you do not know what is in your reactive mind, it is hidden for you .. so it is said from LRH ..

    Why this question? LRH said once: Case: The whole sum of past bypassed charge .. which makes sense .. because it says that all case is basically an product of ARC breaks which you can dramatize .. hang up with it and do not give your ARC anymore .. which means you go down the line of DEINR and start it again and again .. up to the point where you are stupid ..

    For LRH it looks like, that the reactive mind was much more able than YOU but what is about this alien beings .. these are also more able than YOU ..

    • I think LRH determined “truth” by E-meter reaction to what he was thinking.

      • vinaire: You mean he thought Xenu and made an e-meter check on all his staff .. and then he asked what comes up about in your mind .. most of them said then “big implanter” or else, and planes, vulcanoes .. and then he put it together as a story out of his mind ..

        You mean he could also say Zampalo .. and everybody came up with a clown, circus and fire under earth surface .. and he had got the same story together ..

        LRH came up with Fac One in the early years, here he began with his story about a prison planet earth .. and that we all have to report back in case of death .. so that we can run on our implant ..

        If it would be true, I am sure Buddha or Jesus or Mohammed and a lot more people had told us about before .. there is no reason to make it confidental if it would be true .. the only reason why it is hold confidental is from my view that it includes some liabilities for LRH .. so he made up a story about planet Earth .. and when we go through this story, we make him release from his nightmares or dramatizations .. running out his overts against Earth or so ..

        Fac One is 1 Mio years ago .. OT III is 70 Mio yeras ago .. at this times were very few people on Earth .. earth was basically a zoo for animals and plants .. it changed about 50.000 years ago .. apes became man so is said and written .. some visitor in this zoo did die and began to work in small gradients .. and mankind grow up ..

  36. CDEINR .. curious .. desire .. enforced .. inhibit .. no .. refused .. the last one is originally called from LRH as false .. someone has given refused as the same as false .. but in the line of this scale it is false ..

    Lets say, in German is refused given as “verweigern” or “abgelehnt” .. none of this words is close to “false” .. but this scale says only in which state your ARC is and how it is evaluated from others .. and how you go with that ..

    I will say, nobody will ever go from refused to curious .. but you will go from false to curious .. if you have to accept false ARC you will go to find a new one .. if you accept refused ARC you will go into protest .. which will not solve anything at all .. you will only have an ARC break ..

    The original bridge from LRH is designed to run you back to your own ARC, and that is good work from him .. but he missed his way when he figured the SerFac after the ARC break on his bridge .. I mean, it is easy to figure a SerFac out of an ARC break .. and you can also figure an ARC break out of a SerFac of another .. so is the ARC break the source and not other ..

    It is useable for this alien beings (there are surely some there) but it is used in tech from LRH as complete SerFac beings .. all of them have more than evil purposes .. bad sign .. but it do not follow ARC ..

    My consequence is, that no one who did ever OT III was a Clear .. he would not accept such data as ARC .. has nothing to do with Clear ..

  37. I wonder if we are merely the tools of different narratives and ideas that are at war with each other.

    • You get the best answer by spotting and resolving the inconsistency for yourself. To do so all you have to do is look more closely with mindfulness.

  38. Another ice storm in the South. Gee, I miss that global warming thing.
    Mark

    • Mark C. Rathbun

      Are you serious?

      • Hello Mark from Mark.

        Living in south Texas, I would imagine that the potential for every added degree of temperature is excruciating. I lived in central Texas for several years and experienced 110-112F temps. Not fun. This was in the late 70s before global warming was a thought.

        Fortunately, the latest NASA climate models, using unaltered data, point toward a normal cooling trend for about the next 30 years, similar to temps in the late 17, early 1800s.

        I spoke recently to some gentlemen at MSFC at Redstone and the UA Huntsville weather research center. The greatest effort was weeding out the skewed and outright invented data which has driven most climate models up until now. It seems that solar output cycles and orbital differences are the major influence in macro weather conditions. CO2 is a very minor factor and would have to increase by a multiple of 15 to 30 times in order to have much influence.

        The one proven man made climate change was from the early 60s to the mid 80s when particulates in the upper troposphere and lower stratosphere
        from European and Indian industry altered weather patterns in central and eastern Africa, contributing to the drought, most notably in Ethiopia. Decreases in solar energy reaching the surface of up to 7% were recorded in the seas off of east Africa and surrounding areas.

        Industrial atmospheric particulate output has since been reduced by over 80% in that area. I worked for 12 years on industrial furnace particulate scrubber systems.
        Mark

    • This global warming yes/no debate misses the point entirely: that we, as a race, are ruining the foundations of life on our planet at a rapid clip.

      If you want to make the planetary temperature a matter of belief or disbelief, go ahead. Just remember that the real issue is human impact on biodiversity and the ecology. So while you war about who’s wrong, ask yourself what humanity actually gives to the other beings on mother earth.

      • My greatest ecological concern is massive deforestation, most notably in South America, but also on a grand scale all over the world. But that is an argument for other days and other blogs. I have some trees I have to cut and trim this spring, so perhaps I’m the wrong person to discuss this subject.
        Mark

    • You are confusing “climate” with “weather”.

      • It…..was…..a…..joke. Apparently a very small joke.
        Except for the ice storm part. Couldn’t drive, couldn’t even walk. Lost power. Twice in 2 weeks. Nashville got hit HARD. 3/4 to 1″ of ice everywhere.
        Mark

        PS” I try to avoid news and political comments on this site. Marty deserves that. But sometimes I let something slip. My apologies.

        • Mark C. Rathbun

          It was very revelatory of the type of thinking scientology instills.

          • Mark C. Rathbun

            Or perhaps the type of thinking scientology exploits.

          • Thanks Marty. For the last few years I have been questioning the source of my lines of thinking, past and present. You have been wise to question them also, keeps me in line and on my toes.

            When I throw something out on instinct, or to be slightly funny, there is always a reason underlying. Your quips have been more useful to me than you know.

            Again, thank you. There is insight to be found everywhere.
            Mark

  39. basketballjane

    Marty,
    Just finished reading all the comments after this post! Whoa nelly.
    I just read the book, “The Alchemist” by Paulo Coehlo. Have you read that?
    Fascinating book and really echoes your sentiment.
    Thank you for writing down everything you did, for all your analysis of the tomes of data, and for letting all of us watch your evolution through this journey.
    It has been and continues to be a wild ride. But one thing I have learned is to do what Bruce Lee said, “Be Water my friend.” I hope you continue on your journey and best of luck and happiness to you my friend.

    • Mark C. Rathbun

      Thanks for the recommend. Haven’t read it yet, but will.

      • basketballjane

        It is a great book and will help for sure. I saw the Film on Monday Night at LACMA with my mom. We were really emotional about it. I hope you have stopped dying deaths. It is the past. None of us have time machines. We can’t go back there and change it. What’s done is done. It’s like I tell my kids. You made the mistake and now it is over. Now, right now it is time to be better and learn from what happened. You have done far more than your fair share of amends for all real and imagined transgressions. You are a good person and you are loved.

  40. Mike Rinder will be proud.

  41. If any Scientologist could move a bit of tinfoil or plastic wrap sitting on a table, with their minds, under scientific rigorous controls, then fine, I’d give Hubbard some credibility. But none can. Some have moved things with the help of nature, air moving coincidentally, I’ve even witnessed that be done by one of my “preclears” once, I saw him stop the curtains from fluttering, so we thought, but it’s normal life’s coincidences that are at play at “proving” Scientologists’ “OT” accomplishments.

    Scientologists are just people, like everyone else.

    “….quit fast…..” is Hubbard’s most succinct advice to take! And never join.

    • Hi Chuck.
      It is a bit frustrating when one can recall long periods when moving MEST directly, easily and as a matter of course. But those were different environs with different rules. These days, I can move any amount of MEST any time I want, but no one else notices. But we knew the rules when we signed up for this place. Oh well, I’ll just make do with what I can do. Everyone else does.
      Mark

  42. At a gig recently, the Going Clear doc came up in conversation with a friend who I have been gigging with for the last year or so, I knew he was a Scientologist and I wanted to get a reaction. He told me to check out FreedomMag.org to get the truth. He then told me that he has been working on a sound track at Gold Studios (I googled it) for a counter documentary regarding some of the people involved in the HBO documentary. He said that he personally saw an XXX rated sex tape and some other footage of video rental contracts and websites that the Church’s investigators had . He said that they are compiling a free 90 minute DVD for mass distribution to counter and prove that the HBO doc is full of lies and is strictly a money making venture that has nothing to do with the truth. He claims that there are some very heavy weight celebrity individuals involved in this project and he says they have gone all out on this. His exact words used in describing what snippets he saw thus far was “disgusting”.

  43. Re: Any teacher or prophet who does not genuinely wish, encourage and enable students or adherents to ultimately learn and discover beyond what he has to impart is really no teacher or prophet at all.

    The theatrical release of the Alex Gibney/HBO Films Documentary, “Going Clear: Scientology & the Prison of Belief,” is three days away. I’m reading for the first time Lawrence Wright’s book on which the film is based. Today, a friend and I talked during lunch, and he found out that I’ve been a Scientologist for the two years that he’s known me. He’s never been in Scientology Inc. (“SI”), and is a kind, patient, warm Christian. He’s been in the hospital recovering from a sickness and has spent plenty of afternoons recently watching a plethora of talk shows as well as news coverage on SI. I shared my excitement for having a ticket to the movie for this Friday, and he wanted to know more about my enthusiasm. As I started to explain where I’m coming from, I found that I had to actually reel myself back in from what the book calls the “prison of belief.” After 37 years in SI (and only 7 months out), I have layers of false data that I’m stripping off; peeling it as one would an onion. L. Ron Hubbard (“LRH”) wanted me all to himself, and I fell for SI, hook, line and sinker. In talking to my friend today, I discovered that I have to hold myself back and not fall into the old ways of seeing life as I used to see it: through SI’s pretty little kaleidoscope. Through that Looking Glass, I saw, examined, and observed the World According to LRH. SI’s prophet, his juniors and his followers did not genuinely enable, encourage or wish me to see and educate myself on anything outside of SI’s box. Now that I’m out of SI, I’m free to roam and am enjoying myself.

    • christianscientology

      Hi Fred

      Your story reminded me of the Buddhist tale of the young monk who had been brought up in the monastery and when he was in his teens he went to the Abbot to ask permission that he might leave and go experience the world outside the confines of the order. The Abbot reprimanded him and sent him back to continue his duties. A year passed and once more the young monk approached the Abbot to request he might leave the monastery and experience the wider world. Again the Abbot berated him and sent him back to get on with his prayers and meditation. As time passed he came to realise it was no use seeking the Abbots permission to leave and in due course he plucked up the courage to just walk out.

      After several years out in the world he started to miss the fellowship of his fellow monks and also wanted to share his new perspectives, and so slightly nervously he returned to the monastery thinking the Abbot would not allow him to associate with his friends, and that he would be seen as an outcast. To his surprise the Abbot welcomed him back and it was party time at the monastery.

      When he enquired of the Abbot why the welcome back when he had left without permission, the wise old Abbot said “When you were seeking permission to leave I knew you were not ready to confront the world at large”.

      Love with understanding
      Pip

  44. NeedToSayOneThing

    Mr. Rathbun,
    I have been lurking your column since near the start. I believe what is happening today, all the info coming out to the mainstream, is because you started your blog and you’ve gone thru your journey in public – very not easy. Your thoughts have evolved if you go back to those first few years of blogging but you put a very bright spotlight on the whole frightening shadow the organization. Thank you for letting us see inside Scientology … ugly wart that it is. I cannot begin to guess how many ppl you, Mike Rinder and the rest have helped or what you’ve gone through in the process and continue to go through. You are all very strong individuals. While blind celebrities get the print, you brought so much more to what I know and never thought existed. Thank you.

  45. When critics criticize scientologists for believing in Xenu and the Marcabians and other crazy stuff, scientologists, (and possibly DM and his minions are the worse) accuse Christians of believing in something as ludicrous as the virgin birth.

    Well, that virgin birth may not be as ludicrous as DM, his mionions, scientologists and others may think according to this video by Ron Wyatt.

    Watch it and decide for yourself:

    There are two parts and many other supporting videos on the right side to watch.

    Dio

Leave a Reply

Fill in your details below or click an icon to log in:

WordPress.com Logo

You are commenting using your WordPress.com account. Log Out / Change )

Twitter picture

You are commenting using your Twitter account. Log Out / Change )

Facebook photo

You are commenting using your Facebook account. Log Out / Change )

Google+ photo

You are commenting using your Google+ account. Log Out / Change )

Connecting to %s